Hurricane YHWH (Special Episode)

[00:00:00] Welcome to Sacrilegious Discourse.

[00:00:01] For this is what the Sovereign Lord says!

[00:00:04] Why do you need prophets to tell people who you are and what you want?

[00:00:07] If you can justify everything that the God of the Bible has done,

[00:00:11] then you can justify any of your behavior.

[00:00:14] A lot of this mentality is trickling into what is now mainstream right-wing Christianity.

[00:00:20] I am capable of empathy greater than this God of the Bible.

[00:00:26] This is a Bible that they tell kids.

[00:00:29] This is the good Lord.

[00:00:31] This is the good book.

[00:00:32] He is fantasizing about murder.

[00:00:35] Mass murder.

[00:00:37] Go to Sacrilegious Discourse.com right now to find out how to leave us a review or support us on Patreon.

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[00:01:46] Wife!

[00:01:46] Guess what we're doing today?

[00:01:48] Well, we got off to a shitty start this week.

[00:01:51] I can tell you that.

[00:01:52] We did, we did.

[00:01:52] But it's the end of a shitty book, so I don't feel totally okay.

[00:01:55] Right, and we had less episodes to do this week in general, so we were like, when we fell behind on Monday and Tuesday, we're like, well...

[00:02:03] There was less inclination to pack it all in.

[00:02:07] Yeah.

[00:02:08] So today is Wednesday.

[00:02:11] It is!

[00:02:12] And on Wednesdays, we do this thing that's live on Discord.

[00:02:16] In our Discord.

[00:02:16] Yeah.

[00:02:17] 10pm Eastern on Wednesdays.

[00:02:19] And we do special episodes.

[00:02:21] Mm-hmm.

[00:02:21] So that's what we're doing today.

[00:02:23] That is what we're doing.

[00:02:24] And you want to tell everybody what we're special episode-ing today?

[00:02:27] I don't have a good title for it yet, so you will have to come up with a title for that.

[00:02:34] I'll figure it out.

[00:02:34] Yeah.

[00:02:34] But the basic summary is how evangelical Christians and radical religious folk...

[00:02:43] Christian nationalists?

[00:02:44] Yes.

[00:02:45] Essentially.

[00:02:46] They have, throughout the last few decades, kind of been a real sore point of whenever there's a national tragedy.

[00:02:58] They basically are like, well, you shits had it coming for taking prayer out of school and stuff like that.

[00:03:04] Examples would be when Hurricane Katrina hit New Orleans, and they were like, well, I mean, it's New Orleans.

[00:03:11] Of course God hates you.

[00:03:12] Right, debauchery and cheese.

[00:03:13] Yeah.

[00:03:13] What the fuck?

[00:03:14] And then, again, with another example being not a nature-inspired one or a man-made...

[00:03:23] Unless, of course, you want to talk about a hurricane being climate change.

[00:03:27] This was specifically man-made in that it was the Pulse dance club or nightclub shooting in Florida that was directed toward the LGBTQ community.

[00:03:44] And, you know, of course, they had it coming, you know?

[00:03:49] So...

[00:03:49] Right.

[00:03:50] Well, I mean, that's how the view goes with regard to...

[00:03:53] Obviously.

[00:03:53] Yeah, that's what I mean.

[00:03:54] Sure.

[00:03:54] I obviously don't think that.

[00:03:55] Right, right.

[00:03:56] And how that attitude has not really been present very much while Florida is getting decimated.

[00:04:03] And isn't that interesting?

[00:04:06] With hurricanes Helene and then Milton, somehow Florida doesn't have it coming, I guess.

[00:04:13] No, but then this is not something we're going to talk about today.

[00:04:15] But something I have heard now pop up for both hurricanes has been weather manipulation.

[00:04:22] Oh, yeah, I heard that too.

[00:04:24] Like, people just randomly are talking...

[00:04:27] I've heard it in the world.

[00:04:29] Yes.

[00:04:30] Like, not just like on the news or on social media.

[00:04:32] People are...

[00:04:33] But I've heard it said to me directly.

[00:04:35] In person.

[00:04:36] At your work, some customer walked in and was talking about it with you.

[00:04:39] Yeah, they were talking about how...

[00:04:42] So, I just have to share this real quick.

[00:04:44] We're not going to get into it.

[00:04:45] But apparently there's this theory out there that the government has manipulated the weather to send the last hurricane over Asheville specifically because there's material underneath Asheville that's really good for building batteries.

[00:04:59] That is like a double conspiracy.

[00:05:02] Right.

[00:05:03] That's not just like...

[00:05:04] It's crazy.

[00:05:05] Like, not only do the frogs make you gay, but they also are nuclear and we throw them at other countries and have nuclear bombs at them.

[00:05:19] Right.

[00:05:19] Like, what?

[00:05:20] Yeah.

[00:05:20] Like, how do they come up with this shit?

[00:05:23] Well, I think any good conspiracy has got some merit, like some truth to it, right?

[00:05:29] There probably are experiments with regard to weather manipulation.

[00:05:32] But to the extent that we control it and direct it at a city to then get the resources out of the ground underneath that city because there's no one left, that's ridiculous.

[00:05:42] The only bit of truth that I could even a little bit see behind that is them misunderstanding what climate change is or man-made climate change and somehow misinterpreting that into they're doing the climate change and that means weather and they're doing weather.

[00:06:03] They're controlling weather.

[00:06:04] Right.

[00:06:05] Like, I can see that stupidity.

[00:06:07] Sure.

[00:06:08] But everything else, I'm like, what are...

[00:06:10] What?

[00:06:11] Right.

[00:06:12] So anyway, that was our intro, which we're going to be covering basically how people view who is responsible for a disaster, right?

[00:06:24] Depending on...

[00:06:25] If it's a good disaster, taking care of something that they feel that should have been taken care of, God caused it, right?

[00:06:31] If it's not a good disaster and killing good people, then obviously the Democrats...

[00:06:35] I mean, oh, I'm sorry.

[00:06:36] The...

[00:06:37] Atheists or non-religious.

[00:06:38] Somebody else caused it and God's going to help them get through it.

[00:06:44] But there's more too.

[00:06:46] Right.

[00:06:46] Not only that, but they come up with something else that the non-Christians are doing to bury them.

[00:06:54] Sure.

[00:06:54] We'll get into that.

[00:06:56] We'll get into the intro and let's talk more about this in the episode here.

[00:06:58] Okie dokie.

[00:06:59] This is going to be a release for everybody though.

[00:07:02] Yeah.

[00:07:02] Yeah.

[00:07:02] So everybody gets to hear this one.

[00:07:04] Wee!

[00:07:04] And this is our bi-weekly, you know, one for Patreon, one not for Patreon thing.

[00:07:08] So here's our special.

[00:07:10] Okay.

[00:07:10] Let's do it.

[00:07:11] Okie dokie.

[00:07:18] Okie.

[00:07:18] So we are jumping into our very special episode.

[00:07:22] Yeah.

[00:07:23] And I'm going to start out with a literature assignment.

[00:07:28] I'm going to start out before you start out.

[00:07:30] Okie.

[00:07:31] With a...

[00:07:31] I hope that everybody in Florida, Central Florida is ok and safe and doing well.

[00:07:36] Oh, that's nice of you.

[00:07:38] So are you...

[00:07:38] Because we are going to be talking about disasters and this is falling on the heels of the landfall

[00:07:42] of Hurricane Milton and there are a lot of displaced people and a lot of people going

[00:07:47] through a rough time right now.

[00:07:49] So...

[00:07:49] Yeah.

[00:07:50] And I don't send thoughts and prayers because I don't have prayers and I don't have a lot

[00:07:56] of thoughts either.

[00:07:57] If you ask my husband, he says I don't have many thoughts.

[00:08:00] Well...

[00:08:00] But I do send my heart and my hope that they are...

[00:08:05] As many people as possible are able to recover from this.

[00:08:08] And I encourage, you know, if you have the ability to help people out down there with

[00:08:10] monetary or whatever, you know, get on a place that will, you know, let you do that.

[00:08:15] I might even try to find a couple of links in our show notes to do that.

[00:08:19] So...

[00:08:19] I agree.

[00:08:20] I wanted to throw that out there just because of when and how, you know, what we're talking

[00:08:24] about and when this is going out.

[00:08:26] That is true.

[00:08:26] That is true.

[00:08:26] I don't want the people, the good people of Florida to think that I am trashing them.

[00:08:33] I don't want any...

[00:08:34] Well, right now I don't want...

[00:08:36] Anyway.

[00:08:36] Yes.

[00:08:38] It's so cute how you try to tap dance and I'm just like...

[00:08:42] All right.

[00:08:43] So, as I was saying, I'm going to assign a literary bit of homework.

[00:08:49] Okay.

[00:08:49] Everybody has to go home from this and read Voltaire's Candide.

[00:08:54] What if they're already home?

[00:08:56] Then they have to get on their phone and go to the Libby app that I know that they have

[00:09:04] connected to their local library and they have to borrow a copy, digital copy or an audio copy.

[00:09:13] Actually, I think most books, like I know Google Books and other places, that's a free book.

[00:09:19] Mm-hmm.

[00:09:19] So you can download it pretty much anywhere.

[00:09:21] Okay.

[00:09:21] So, because it's old enough that it's not proprietary.

[00:09:25] Right.

[00:09:25] It's out of whatever...

[00:09:28] I can't even think of the word now.

[00:09:29] I know.

[00:09:29] What's the word?

[00:09:30] It's not copyright.

[00:09:31] Well, yeah.

[00:09:31] It's copyright basically.

[00:09:32] Yeah.

[00:09:33] It's outside of the copyright time frame.

[00:09:34] Okay.

[00:09:35] So, by far.

[00:09:36] Okay.

[00:09:36] Well, all I know is that Candide is one of the first books that I read as a young adult

[00:09:43] in a Western Civ class.

[00:09:47] Yeah.

[00:09:47] And I just thought it was so fucking funny and I didn't get all of it so I had to read

[00:09:53] it again later.

[00:09:54] Sure.

[00:09:54] But it's super sarcastic.

[00:09:57] And there's relevancy here.

[00:09:59] Okay.

[00:10:00] All right.

[00:10:00] So, Voltaire's Candide serves as an extremely biting critique of optimism.

[00:10:06] Okay.

[00:10:07] Which I'm going to get into how that relates.

[00:10:09] Okay.

[00:10:10] Particularly through the philosophy that is espoused by one of the main characters.

[00:10:15] His name is Pangloss and he's a philosopher.

[00:10:18] Okay.

[00:10:19] Mm-hmm.

[00:10:19] That's why he has a philosophy that he espouses.

[00:10:22] That's what philosophers do.

[00:10:23] Right.

[00:10:23] And he believes that all is for the best in the best of all possible worlds.

[00:10:28] Okay.

[00:10:29] Okay.

[00:10:29] When you take that to its furthest extreme, that means that whatever happens, it must be

[00:10:33] for the good because this is the best of all possible worlds.

[00:10:36] Sure.

[00:10:37] So, only good things happen.

[00:10:38] Right.

[00:10:39] Right.

[00:10:39] And so, if hurricanes come, well, that's just meant to be and this is the best of all possible

[00:10:44] worlds.

[00:10:45] Right.

[00:10:45] You know?

[00:10:46] That's in a God-based world where things...

[00:10:49] Yeah.

[00:10:49] Right.

[00:10:49] Right.

[00:10:49] Yes.

[00:10:50] And Voltaire was extremely opposed to this mentality which is, has been adopted by evangelical

[00:10:59] Christians throughout history.

[00:11:01] Sure.

[00:11:01] Okay.

[00:11:01] Now, he wrote during the Enlightenment.

[00:11:04] Yeah.

[00:11:04] Like, he's renowned for that.

[00:11:06] Right.

[00:11:06] So, we're talking like several hundred years ago.

[00:11:08] Right.

[00:11:08] Yeah.

[00:11:13] Okay.

[00:11:17] So, a bunch of bad shit happens to him.

[00:11:23] I mean, we're talking, they get syphilis and they get conscripted into an army and like,

[00:11:29] have to...

[00:11:30] It's just...

[00:11:31] I mean, so much bad shit happens.

[00:11:33] Right.

[00:11:33] Okay?

[00:11:33] Yeah.

[00:11:34] So, anyway, the positivity of the outlook is challenged by...

[00:11:38] Or the outlook of positivity is challenged by earthquakes, shipwrecks, human cruelty.

[00:11:44] I mean, like I said, just lots and lots of stuff.

[00:11:46] Lots and lots of disasters and horrible shit.

[00:11:48] Horrible shit.

[00:11:48] Yeah.

[00:11:48] It becomes absurdly clear when juxtaposed with the catastrophic events and the suffering experienced

[00:11:57] by the characters.

[00:11:58] Yeah.

[00:11:59] Such as, there's a sinking ship scene wherein bystanders rationalize in action by deferring

[00:12:07] to divine providence.

[00:12:08] And I've referenced this particular scene before...

[00:12:11] Right.

[00:12:12] ...as an excuse to not get involved and help.

[00:12:16] They're just like, well, if they're meant to survive, they will.

[00:12:18] I never really understood that because if you decided to get involved, would that also

[00:12:21] be divine providence?

[00:12:22] Right.

[00:12:23] But because you didn't decide to...

[00:12:25] Right.

[00:12:25] ...you don't have to.

[00:12:26] Right.

[00:12:27] It's very self-congratulatory.

[00:12:29] It allows you to let yourself off the hook.

[00:12:31] Yes.

[00:12:32] Actually, that's one of the phrases here in this document that I've put together.

[00:12:36] Right.

[00:12:36] Yes.

[00:12:37] As the vessel goes down, passengers and crew are conserved...

[00:12:41] I'm sorry, consumed with self-preservation, believing that God will save those who deserve

[00:12:46] it.

[00:12:47] Of course, we all know that that's not what happens.

[00:12:49] Yeah, and that's not how that works.

[00:12:50] Right.

[00:12:51] Exactly.

[00:12:51] Exactly.

[00:12:52] This fatalistic attitude prevents them from helping others, particularly highlighting the

[00:12:57] disconnect between faith and action and revealing a hypocrisy that Voltaire critiques in this

[00:13:04] book.

[00:13:04] Yeah.

[00:13:05] Okay.

[00:13:05] I, like I said, highly recommend.

[00:13:07] Right.

[00:13:07] Right.

[00:13:08] This attitude resonates with certain contemporary Christian perspectives on climate change and

[00:13:15] natural disasters, which often attribute suffering to divine judgment or a lack of moral value among

[00:13:22] the affected.

[00:13:23] Right.

[00:13:23] You know, like if you be gay or something, that is so bad.

[00:13:27] Yeah.

[00:13:28] You know?

[00:13:28] So if you get hurt while you're being gay, then, you know, you had that shit coming.

[00:13:34] According to this mentality.

[00:13:36] According to this philosophy.

[00:13:37] Right.

[00:13:37] Yeah.

[00:13:38] You just...

[00:13:39] Did you try not being gay is their question?

[00:13:42] And it's like, you're an ignoramus and I hate you.

[00:13:45] Sure.

[00:13:45] So anyway, this results in a circular logic somehow proving, quote unquote, that tragedies

[00:13:52] are in fact divine punishment for perceived sin and that those affected are somehow deserving

[00:13:58] of their fate.

[00:13:59] Right.

[00:13:59] I mean, like how long is it going to be after the hurricanes before we start seeing pictures

[00:14:04] of the Bibles that survived?

[00:14:05] Yeah.

[00:14:05] You know what I mean?

[00:14:07] I'm surprised.

[00:14:08] They're going to start bringing God into it and saying, well, God saved this Bible.

[00:14:12] Yeah.

[00:14:13] Yeah.

[00:14:13] So he must be doing something.

[00:14:15] Yeah.

[00:14:16] The victims of places that evangelicals don't like, they had it coming.

[00:14:21] Right.

[00:14:21] The victims of places that they do like, we don't talk about the ones who died.

[00:14:26] We talk about the ones who survived and they did survive because of God's grace.

[00:14:31] Like there's a pretty famous liberal town near where we live.

[00:14:35] Mm-hmm.

[00:14:35] And I would imagine that if, you know, if, if a meteor hit it or something, right?

[00:14:41] Mm-hmm.

[00:14:41] I feel like the, the right wing, the, the Christian nationalist would almost be somewhat gleeful.

[00:14:48] They would.

[00:14:49] Not, not openly gleeful.

[00:14:51] But.

[00:14:52] Well, some of them would.

[00:14:53] They would definitely.

[00:14:54] They don't hide it much anymore, honey.

[00:14:56] Right, right.

[00:14:56] So I would say that.

[00:14:57] But they would, they would definitely say that they deserved it.

[00:14:59] Oh yeah.

[00:15:00] And that it was because there was a bunch of heathens and, and, and whatever that lived

[00:15:04] there.

[00:15:05] And that's why God was punishing.

[00:15:07] Yes.

[00:15:07] That town.

[00:15:08] Right.

[00:15:08] And I just can't, I can't stomach that idea.

[00:15:11] That's, that's horrible.

[00:15:13] That's a horrible way to think.

[00:15:14] Okay.

[00:15:14] I am.

[00:15:14] I'm going to be honest.

[00:15:15] When, um, the big giant statue of Jesus on I-75.

[00:15:20] Sure.

[00:15:20] When it got struck by lightning and, but part of it burnt on fire.

[00:15:25] Yes.

[00:15:25] I laughed because I thought the irony was so fucking hilarious.

[00:15:29] But.

[00:15:30] Look up, look up Big Butter Jesus.

[00:15:31] Big Butter Jesus.

[00:15:32] You'll find it.

[00:15:33] Which is now $5 foot long Jesus.

[00:15:35] Right.

[00:15:36] Or Big Butter Jesus fire.

[00:15:37] Yeah.

[00:15:38] You'll find it definitely at that point.

[00:15:40] Yeah.

[00:15:40] But, but here's the thing.

[00:15:41] But nobody got hurt in that.

[00:15:43] Nobody got hurt.

[00:15:44] And, and moreover, it wasn't that we thought that they got punished.

[00:15:49] No.

[00:15:49] We just thought it was funny.

[00:15:51] It's, it's, it's, it's funny because those same people would say that about another

[00:15:55] instance, like if it had hit a mosque.

[00:15:57] Yeah.

[00:15:57] Right.

[00:15:58] Yeah.

[00:15:58] And that wouldn't have made national news, but if it had hit a mosque, the people

[00:16:02] that like, let's say there was a mosque next door to that church.

[00:16:05] Mm-hmm.

[00:16:05] And this church is kind of infamous for like, they were COVID deniers.

[00:16:08] They were, there was all kinds of crappy shit that came out of this church.

[00:16:11] Aren't they the same ones that protest outside of funerals or something?

[00:16:16] No, you're thinking of Westboro Baptist Church.

[00:16:17] Oh, you're right.

[00:16:18] You're right.

[00:16:18] I am.

[00:16:19] Nevermind.

[00:16:19] But anyway, that the, let's just say it hit a mosque that happened to be very close or

[00:16:25] next door to this church.

[00:16:26] Right.

[00:16:26] Mm-hmm.

[00:16:27] The people that went to that church would be like, that's because they don't believe

[00:16:30] in the right God.

[00:16:32] Yeah.

[00:16:32] You know, they, they would legitimately.

[00:16:35] Attribute it.

[00:16:35] Probably the majority.

[00:16:36] Look, I'm speaking for other people, but based on what I have seen of their actions

[00:16:40] and what they do.

[00:16:41] Yeah.

[00:16:41] Yeah.

[00:16:41] I would say the majority of the people that go to that church would think that that is

[00:16:44] exactly what happened.

[00:16:45] Right.

[00:16:46] They, they were being, that other place was being judged.

[00:16:49] Right.

[00:16:49] And was found wanting and therefore.

[00:16:52] Yeah.

[00:16:52] Yeah.

[00:16:53] Whereas, you know, when the lightning struck big butter Jesus and burnt them down, it was

[00:16:59] just funny.

[00:17:00] Right.

[00:17:01] And they use it as well, they obviously like, they'll say things like, well, they obviously

[00:17:04] wanted us to spend more time together to learn more about God so that we could work together

[00:17:09] to build this new.

[00:17:10] And they, they dumped more millions.

[00:17:13] They did.

[00:17:14] More millions.

[00:17:15] Which is really disgusting to me.

[00:17:16] Yeah.

[00:17:17] Same.

[00:17:17] Same.

[00:17:17] Like you're, you're a church that wants to help people.

[00:17:19] And instead of helping them, you're building a millions of dollar statue.

[00:17:23] Idol.

[00:17:23] Idol.

[00:17:24] Yeah.

[00:17:24] Outside of your church, instead of like donating money to the poor.

[00:17:28] Right.

[00:17:28] Right.

[00:17:29] Yeah.

[00:17:29] That's just absurd to me.

[00:17:30] But that statue will bring people to God.

[00:17:33] That's what, how statues work.

[00:17:34] No, I know.

[00:17:35] I know.

[00:17:35] I understand why they think that's a good thing, but.

[00:17:38] I've never seen a statue that ever convinced me.

[00:17:42] I'm going to disagree.

[00:17:43] Same.

[00:17:44] Same.

[00:17:44] So in the wake of disasters like Hurricane Katrina, many evangelical leaders expressed

[00:17:50] beliefs that the storm was a form of divine punishment for the sins of the city, including

[00:17:57] its acceptance of LGBTQIA plus individuals, its diverse cultural reputation and the immoral, quote unquote, behaviors associated with its nightlife and music scene.

[00:18:09] Yeah.

[00:18:09] I heard you when I said cultural, its diverse cultural reputation.

[00:18:14] Let's be honest.

[00:18:15] It didn't hit white people.

[00:18:16] Right.

[00:18:16] Yeah.

[00:18:17] Right.

[00:18:17] Who'd it hit?

[00:18:18] It hit the brown people.

[00:18:19] Right.

[00:18:20] And, you know, nobody, nobody cares about them.

[00:18:23] Right.

[00:18:23] Yeah.

[00:18:25] According to.

[00:18:26] Yeah.

[00:18:26] No, I'm not right.

[00:18:28] Right.

[00:18:28] Obviously.

[00:18:30] Many of these Christians suggested that the city's perceived moral failings made it deserving

[00:18:36] of such punishment, which that's just tragic.

[00:18:39] Yeah, it is.

[00:18:40] This perspective mirrors the fatalistic resignation scene in Candide, where the ship's passengers

[00:18:46] believe that those destined to survive will be saved by God, leaving them inactive in

[00:18:52] the face of dire circumstances.

[00:18:53] And that's exactly what happened.

[00:18:56] Yeah.

[00:18:56] I mean, there are a lot of people that are like, well, oh, well, you know, people that

[00:19:00] survive are meant to survive.

[00:19:01] They will.

[00:19:02] You know?

[00:19:03] Yeah.

[00:19:03] Like you said, they're off the hook now because it's up to God.

[00:19:07] Give it to God.

[00:19:08] Right.

[00:19:08] Jesus take the wheel kind of thing, you know?

[00:19:10] Yeah.

[00:19:10] Similarly, I'm having a hard time with words, so I apologize.

[00:19:14] Similarly.

[00:19:16] Yeah.

[00:19:16] The 2016 shooting at the Pulse nightclub in Orlando, Florida, which targeted the LGBTQIA

[00:19:24] plus community was interpreted by some as God's wrath against that community and sparked

[00:19:31] a wave of religious rhetoric, blaming the victims for their perceived immorality.

[00:19:36] It was really disgusting.

[00:19:37] It was gross to see so many people gleeful at the death of these people who were just trying

[00:19:46] to have fun and live their life.

[00:19:48] And they're already struggling against so much, you know, just just to live just to can I just

[00:19:56] live? Can I just go buy my groceries like anybody else?

[00:20:00] Right.

[00:20:00] Could you just not?

[00:20:02] Yeah.

[00:20:02] And then the fact that like where it's already awful and horrible that this thing happened

[00:20:07] to these people.

[00:20:08] Right.

[00:20:09] And so many families and friends were affected by this.

[00:20:12] Like that was a tragedy and an absolute tragedy.

[00:20:16] Yeah.

[00:20:16] And but it gets even worse when you start seeing the reaction from human beings.

[00:20:23] Right.

[00:20:24] To to what happened to these people.

[00:20:27] And you realize that there is so much hate in the world.

[00:20:33] And I just I can't fathom what it takes to not only see this happen, but then feel the

[00:20:42] need to stand up and say they deserved it.

[00:20:45] Right.

[00:20:45] Like what the fuck?

[00:20:47] Right.

[00:20:48] Why?

[00:20:48] Why?

[00:20:50] I look at I would never think this that would never be something that crossed my mind.

[00:20:55] I don't care how shitty of a Christian you are, how much of a Christian nationalist

[00:20:59] you are.

[00:21:00] I there's there's there's not any time where I would stand up and say they deserve that.

[00:21:06] I would like to be that person, but I'm going to be honest and say that if I know that

[00:21:12] that person has been cruel and harmful toward others and made other people's lives difficult.

[00:21:19] OK, I'm not talking like the Hitler version here.

[00:21:21] Like if we're talking about Hitler, I'm talking about people like Trump when we were all supposed

[00:21:25] to be, you know, extremely sad that the ricocheted piece of of glass hit his ear.

[00:21:33] He didn't get shot by a bullet.

[00:21:35] Right.

[00:21:35] Just to be clear.

[00:21:36] No, I'm not saying I was glad it happened.

[00:21:38] I'm saying that, you know, I was not sad either.

[00:21:45] You know, right.

[00:21:46] No, I get it.

[00:21:47] But I wasn't out there shouting it either.

[00:21:49] Which is the difference.

[00:21:51] You know, but we're not talking about a group of people who you don't like we're talking about

[00:21:56] a group of people who died.

[00:21:57] Right.

[00:21:58] In an evening because somebody decided to take their lives into their hands and that person

[00:22:03] somebody shot them.

[00:22:04] Right.

[00:22:05] Right.

[00:22:05] Because the queer community is not good.

[00:22:08] No.

[00:22:09] Or whatever.

[00:22:10] None of the people speaking up about these people knew them.

[00:22:13] Right.

[00:22:13] They just hated them for who they thought they were.

[00:22:16] Right.

[00:22:17] Exactly.

[00:22:17] And that was it.

[00:22:18] That was the end of the story.

[00:22:20] It didn't matter what they had done.

[00:22:22] It didn't matter who they were.

[00:22:23] I cannot imagine just painting people by who they identify as as being evil.

[00:22:31] I can't imagine that in and even growing up around Christianity.

[00:22:36] It bothers me because I was always told that it's up to God to judge like that was always

[00:22:40] what was told to me.

[00:22:41] Yeah, it's not right.

[00:22:42] It's not up to us to judge.

[00:22:44] Right.

[00:22:44] But yet I find judgment everywhere in the evangelical Christian world.

[00:22:50] Yeah.

[00:22:50] And it seems to to be even more pervasive in this social media world that we live in.

[00:22:56] Right.

[00:22:56] And it just it bothers it's disturbing.

[00:22:59] Out of me.

[00:22:59] It's very disturbing.

[00:23:00] It is.

[00:23:01] This perspective mirrors the fatalistic resignation scene in Candide where the ship's passengers

[00:23:08] believe that those destined.

[00:23:09] Oh, I already read that.

[00:23:10] Yeah.

[00:23:11] And then Pulse.

[00:23:12] Oops.

[00:23:12] Sorry.

[00:23:12] I must have scrolled.

[00:23:13] I apologize.

[00:23:15] OK, so some Christian.

[00:23:16] I know that happens to me, right?

[00:23:17] Yes, it does.

[00:23:18] Some Christian leaders framed the Pulse shooting tragedy as a consequence of societal decay,

[00:23:28] asserting that such events occur when a community strays from God's path.

[00:23:33] Yeah.

[00:23:34] This deservingness kind of not really a word, but, you know, becomes a word.

[00:23:41] This deservingness narrative aligns with the sentiment on the sinking ship in Candide that suffering is often seen as deserved, leading individuals to disengage from the immediate need for action or support.

[00:23:56] Right.

[00:23:56] It allows people to distance themselves from the suffering of others, absolving themselves of responsibility to act, which is kind of going back to what you said early on.

[00:24:06] Right.

[00:24:06] So these cases all illustrate a troubling aspect of theodicy, which I had not heard of this term.

[00:24:12] OK.

[00:24:12] It's the attempt to reconcile the existence of evil and suffering with a benevolent deity.

[00:24:20] I see.

[00:24:21] Yeah.

[00:24:21] It's the why does God allow bad things to happen?

[00:24:26] Yeah.

[00:24:26] Good people.

[00:24:26] Well, and that's where everybody, you know, not everybody.

[00:24:28] That's where that's where you hear the term.

[00:24:29] Give it to God.

[00:24:30] Right.

[00:24:31] It's all God's plan.

[00:24:32] And it's not ours.

[00:24:33] No.

[00:24:34] Right.

[00:24:34] Yeah.

[00:24:35] Which is which is a simple way of saying.

[00:24:38] Oh, right.

[00:24:38] Yeah.

[00:24:39] I'm too lazy and don't give a shit to think further on it.

[00:24:43] Right.

[00:24:43] I'm fine with that.

[00:24:44] But I still want to judge.

[00:24:46] I still I still want to be able to pass judgment on people.

[00:24:49] But also, I don't know why God doesn't do what I would expect him to do.

[00:24:53] Right.

[00:24:53] So.

[00:24:54] Right.

[00:24:54] Right.

[00:24:54] It's just so gross.

[00:24:56] In Candide, Voltaire critiques this notion through absurdity and irony, rightly suggesting

[00:25:03] that this rationale can lead to inaction and moral blindness in the face of suffering.

[00:25:09] I really liked that phrasing.

[00:25:11] Yeah.

[00:25:11] This resonates with current attitudes where some Christians may view catastrophic events

[00:25:16] as divinely sanctioned retribution.

[00:25:19] So not just they deserved it, but you should have expected it.

[00:25:24] Right.

[00:25:24] Right.

[00:25:25] Like they not only deserved it, but they should have that happen to them.

[00:25:30] Right.

[00:25:30] You know, neglecting the moral imperative to aid those in distress.

[00:25:35] Again, it lets you off the hook for even bothering to help them.

[00:25:39] Yeah.

[00:25:39] If they had it coming and if you're like, well, yeah, God should have them shot.

[00:25:45] God should have that hurricane go there.

[00:25:48] Right.

[00:25:48] That's so gross.

[00:25:50] In the context of climate change, this can manifest as a reluctance to address the issue,

[00:25:56] believing that it's either not real, which we see many people.

[00:25:59] Yeah.

[00:25:59] That's oftentimes the case.

[00:26:01] Or that it's part of God's plan.

[00:26:03] You know, the bigger picture.

[00:26:04] I have.

[00:26:04] You know what?

[00:26:05] I've heard it both ways from the same people.

[00:26:07] Oh, my God.

[00:26:08] Are you serious?

[00:26:08] Oh, yeah.

[00:26:09] No, I mean, like in one sense, you'll they'll start off by saying climate change isn't real.

[00:26:14] That's a liberal agenda.

[00:26:15] Right.

[00:26:16] And then in the next sentence, they're like, well, it's God's plan to, you know, make the

[00:26:22] waters.

[00:26:22] Yeah.

[00:26:23] That's all.

[00:26:24] Haven't you read Revelation?

[00:26:26] You know, like.

[00:26:27] Oh, so it is happening then.

[00:26:28] Okay.

[00:26:29] Yeah.

[00:26:29] Like, which one is it that specifically people that we care about?

[00:26:33] I've heard say something like that.

[00:26:35] And I'm like, oh, so you want in times.

[00:26:38] Yes.

[00:26:38] To manifest itself.

[00:26:40] Yes.

[00:26:40] I think they do because they're going to be just fine in their minds.

[00:26:44] Apparently they're going to go to heaven and see all their families and hug them.

[00:26:48] Yeah.

[00:26:48] Didn't you know?

[00:26:48] Right.

[00:26:49] They're there.

[00:26:50] They know for a fact that that's where they're headed and that's where their family

[00:26:53] members are.

[00:26:54] It's a disturbing mentality to me.

[00:26:55] It really is.

[00:26:55] To live so nihilistically that you cannot fathom caring whether this world dies or lives.

[00:27:03] Right.

[00:27:03] Well, they're saved.

[00:27:04] Why the fuck would they care?

[00:27:05] Right.

[00:27:06] Like, if you are all in on that notion, why the fuck would you care?

[00:27:11] Right.

[00:27:12] So, the focus shifts from mitigating the crisis to judging those perceived to be contributing

[00:27:17] to it.

[00:27:18] Religious rhetoric often reflects a notion of divine protection for the faithful while attributing

[00:27:25] destruction to a moral failing of the broader society.

[00:27:29] A selective interpretation of suffering.

[00:27:33] Selective interpretation of suffering.

[00:27:36] Yeah.

[00:27:36] This, wow.

[00:27:38] The idea of divine protection for the faithful while attributing destruction to the moral failing

[00:27:42] of others is a deeply ingrained narrative in many religious circles.

[00:27:47] This selective interpretation of suffering can be seen in responses to Hurricanes Helene and

[00:27:54] Milton, particularly in a state like Florida with a strong Christian presence.

[00:27:58] Right.

[00:27:59] Yeah.

[00:27:59] Here's how this selective interpretation might manifest.

[00:28:03] One, as you said, God spared us.

[00:28:06] Right.

[00:28:07] Wow.

[00:28:07] Some individuals or communities might interpret their relative safety from the Hurricanes

[00:28:12] as a sign of God's favor and protection, reinforcing their belief in their own righteousness.

[00:28:17] Yeah.

[00:28:18] Like, obviously I'm awesome.

[00:28:20] Right.

[00:28:20] Obviously God loves me.

[00:28:22] Therefore, I can keep on judging those nasty fucks.

[00:28:25] Right.

[00:28:25] Right.

[00:28:26] Yeah.

[00:28:27] That's so cool the way that works.

[00:28:28] Mm-hmm.

[00:28:29] You give yourself a crown and then you're like, well, I'm wearing a crown.

[00:28:32] I must be a king.

[00:28:33] Well, yeah.

[00:28:34] Like, that's another mentality that I cannot, like, if you survive something but other people

[00:28:38] died, you're like, well, I'm obviously better than them.

[00:28:41] Yeah.

[00:28:41] Like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[00:28:43] What?

[00:28:43] Calm your tits, bro.

[00:28:45] Yeah.

[00:28:45] That's your first reaction?

[00:28:46] No.

[00:28:47] Fuck off.

[00:28:47] Right.

[00:28:48] So the first one was God spared us because we're awesome.

[00:28:51] Yeah.

[00:28:52] The second one is they deserved it.

[00:28:54] Right.

[00:28:54] And conversely, the devastation experienced by others might be attributed to their supposed

[00:28:59] moral failings or a lack of faith.

[00:29:01] Well, and even.

[00:29:02] Usually it's hand in hand.

[00:29:03] Sure.

[00:29:03] But even in that case, right?

[00:29:04] It doesn't have to be the entire community.

[00:29:07] They'll be like, well, because this exists there.

[00:29:09] Obviously, that's why it went through there.

[00:29:11] Can you see?

[00:29:12] Like, they'll probably end up being a chart that shows that the predominance of, like,

[00:29:16] something that they consider immoral.

[00:29:19] Right.

[00:29:20] Will be in that band.

[00:29:21] And they don't mind that a bunch of, to their mind, innocent people were wiped out

[00:29:27] along the way.

[00:29:28] Right.

[00:29:28] That's fine.

[00:29:29] Somebody will come up with something like that.

[00:29:30] Oh, yeah.

[00:29:31] That always happens.

[00:29:32] There's always somebody that's going to describe it.

[00:29:34] This is why that happened because yada, yada, yada.

[00:29:36] Yeah.

[00:29:37] And it's like, so I'm sorry.

[00:29:39] Let me just make sure I understand this.

[00:29:40] They killed, like, several hundred thousand people in order to get those, like, 5,000.

[00:29:47] Is that what you're saying?

[00:29:48] Like.

[00:29:49] I'm really hoping that that's not even close to what the death toll would be.

[00:29:53] Yeah.

[00:29:53] I'm just spitting out numbers.

[00:29:55] Sure.

[00:29:55] Like, don't listen to me because I am not a number person.

[00:29:58] And I'm talking out of my asshole right now.

[00:30:01] Right.

[00:30:01] Okay.

[00:30:02] Right.

[00:30:02] So, number three is a focus on individual salvation.

[00:30:07] Right?

[00:30:07] Okay.

[00:30:08] Like, me, me, me, me, me.

[00:30:08] Yeah.

[00:30:09] Emphasis might be placed on individual repentance and seeking God's protection in the face of

[00:30:15] disaster rather than on collective responsibility for social and environmental issues that contribute

[00:30:21] to the impact of such events, such as in the case of human-created climate change.

[00:30:26] Right.

[00:30:27] Well, if you would just get saved like me.

[00:30:29] Something that I've heard a lot from Christians in general is that when something bad happens

[00:30:34] like this, right?

[00:30:35] Let's say that they lose their house, they end up moving to some other state, whatever,

[00:30:40] and they're like, well, God put me here because, you know, he wanted me not...

[00:30:45] It was a divine intervention.

[00:30:47] Yeah.

[00:30:47] I'm where I'm supposed to be at any given moment.

[00:30:49] Right.

[00:30:50] But like rose tinted glasses, right?

[00:30:52] Yeah.

[00:30:52] When your life sucked so bad because you lost everything, right?

[00:30:57] And then you end up somewhere and it doesn't suck quite as bad anymore.

[00:31:00] Yeah.

[00:31:01] You...

[00:31:01] I just have a really hard time attributing that to God.

[00:31:05] I'm like, but if you believe in the same...

[00:31:07] If you believe in that God, right?

[00:31:09] That God destroyed everything you had.

[00:31:11] Right.

[00:31:12] And apparently you probably had it all right down there before that happened.

[00:31:15] Right.

[00:31:16] But you're saying that now that you have it better over here than you did because you

[00:31:21] would have been in a destroyed house and you didn't die, that God intervened.

[00:31:24] And I'm like, well, that's...

[00:31:26] No.

[00:31:27] It's the Job principle.

[00:31:29] Well, I mean, he killed my 10 kids, but he gave me 10 other ones, whatever.

[00:31:32] You know?

[00:31:33] Of course I'm happy.

[00:31:34] Right.

[00:31:34] What?

[00:31:35] They're interchangeable, you know?

[00:31:37] But I just...

[00:31:38] I don't understand how anybody can get past...

[00:31:40] Like, in the Old Testament, I don't understand...

[00:31:43] You know, we have the New Testament where we stop killing people all the time, apparently.

[00:31:47] Yeah.

[00:31:48] We're not there yet, so I don't know that for sure.

[00:31:50] But in the Old Testament, God kills people all the fucking time.

[00:31:54] Entire nations, communities...

[00:31:57] Families.

[00:31:58] Right.

[00:31:59] And if you believe in God, you would have to...

[00:32:02] Because God is responsible for all things, you would have to believe that God is still

[00:32:06] killing people today.

[00:32:07] Right.

[00:32:08] Right?

[00:32:09] Even with Jesus.

[00:32:10] Either that or God is completely uninvolved.

[00:32:13] Right.

[00:32:13] Right?

[00:32:14] One of the two things...

[00:32:15] It can't be both.

[00:32:15] One of those two things is true.

[00:32:16] Yeah.

[00:32:17] So, it just makes no fucking sense.

[00:32:20] No.

[00:32:21] And if you are going to claim that he did this in order to change your life, he did

[00:32:26] that in order to change your life by killing other people.

[00:32:29] Right.

[00:32:29] Like, let's always keep that in mind, right?

[00:32:32] Right.

[00:32:32] Because these actions that are, quote unquote, better for you, ended up terrible or deadly

[00:32:39] for somebody else.

[00:32:40] And you're okay with that, are you?

[00:32:41] Right.

[00:32:42] You don't mind that, you know, 10 or 100 or 1,000 people were dead to make sure that you

[00:32:48] got into a better place, huh?

[00:32:49] Right.

[00:32:49] But the thing...

[00:32:50] What I always hear though is that from their outside perspective, from their perspective

[00:32:53] where their life is better, right?

[00:32:55] Mm-hmm.

[00:32:56] Like, well, God works in mysterious ways, which is a nice way of saying those people were probably

[00:33:00] shitty.

[00:33:01] Yeah.

[00:33:01] They probably deserve to die.

[00:33:02] They didn't pray hard enough.

[00:33:03] And that's just fucking stupid.

[00:33:05] Right.

[00:33:06] That's horrible.

[00:33:07] I mean, that's always my argument when people say it's in God's hands and that God does

[00:33:13] mysterious things and they pray over stupid shit.

[00:33:15] And I'm like, okay, but my nephew has type 1 diabetes.

[00:33:20] Are you saying that my sister and her husband, who are Christians, are you saying that they

[00:33:25] don't pray hard enough?

[00:33:27] Fuck you all the way to Mars and back.

[00:33:28] Fuck.

[00:33:29] Right.

[00:33:29] If you think that they have not prayed for their child to not have that life shortening disease,

[00:33:37] you're a motherfucking moron and I hate you.

[00:33:40] Moreover, to punish a parent by harming a child...

[00:33:44] Right.

[00:33:45] ...is some really, really next level fucked up shit.

[00:33:48] Yeah.

[00:33:49] It's just disgusting.

[00:33:49] So, I just...

[00:33:50] I can't...

[00:33:50] That I cannot accept as an answer either.

[00:33:52] No.

[00:33:53] No.

[00:33:53] I never will.

[00:33:54] Right.

[00:33:54] ...and I don't accept that as an answer.

[00:33:57] And if that means that I have to go to some imaginary hell when I'm dead, I stand by my

[00:34:01] answer.

[00:34:02] Right.

[00:34:02] And, you know, a smug Christian would be like, oh, you say that now.

[00:34:05] And I'm like, yeah, I do say that now.

[00:34:08] Right.

[00:34:08] You know?

[00:34:08] Yeah.

[00:34:09] Yeah.

[00:34:09] And if I have to eat my fucking words, that's the least of my goddamn problems.

[00:34:13] Yeah.

[00:34:14] You know?

[00:34:14] Right.

[00:34:15] Like, me being wrong right now, I don't think that that's going to be the problem I'm worried

[00:34:20] about, quite honestly.

[00:34:21] Right.

[00:34:21] The problem I'm worried about is Hurricane Yahweh.

[00:34:24] Yeah.

[00:34:24] Yeah.

[00:34:25] That's the problem I'm worried about.

[00:34:26] Yeah.

[00:34:27] All right.

[00:34:27] So, number four would be ignoring systemic issues.

[00:34:31] This perspective can downplay the role of factors like climate change, inadequate infrastructure,

[00:34:37] or socioeconomic inequalities in exacerbating the effects of natural disasters.

[00:34:45] Okay.

[00:34:46] So, yeah.

[00:34:47] Sorry.

[00:34:48] This selective interpretation of suffering can have several consequences, more than what

[00:34:55] I just named.

[00:34:56] Okay.

[00:34:57] It can create division and judgment.

[00:34:59] No way.

[00:35:00] Yeah.

[00:35:00] It fosters an us versus them mentality.

[00:35:03] It does.

[00:35:03] It does.

[00:35:04] It very much does.

[00:35:04] Yeah.

[00:35:05] Where those who are spared see themselves as morally superior to those who suffer.

[00:35:09] Like what I was just saying.

[00:35:10] Yeah.

[00:35:10] Number two, it can hinder compassion and aid.

[00:35:14] It can lead to a reluctance to help those affected as they're suffering as seen as deserved.

[00:35:18] Right.

[00:35:19] So, you know, they have no empathy.

[00:35:21] Yeah.

[00:35:21] It seems that it got rotted off the vine, you know?

[00:35:25] Mm-hmm.

[00:35:26] And number three, it can discourage social action.

[00:35:29] By attributing disasters solely to moral failings, it can deflect attention from the need

[00:35:34] to address systemic issues that contribute to the vulnerability that was what allowed the

[00:35:41] thing to happen in the first place.

[00:35:42] Right, right, right.

[00:35:43] Right, right, right.

[00:35:43] But the Christian Nationalists, Fox News, they fixed this, right?

[00:35:47] Sure.

[00:35:48] They were like, no, it's the Democrats' fault.

[00:35:51] Right.

[00:35:52] Right.

[00:35:53] Well, actually, we're going to get into that a little bit now because this is a bit of a

[00:36:01] stray from the they had it coming talk.

[00:36:04] Okay?

[00:36:05] Yeah.

[00:36:06] So we've already pointed out that when neighborhoods or states or cities that are deemed or, you

[00:36:16] know, nightclubs that are deemed as deserving of God's wrath get hit with some kind of disaster,

[00:36:24] Right.

[00:36:24] They had it coming, right?

[00:36:25] Right.

[00:36:25] And so, yay, every evangelical party's down, right?

[00:36:29] Yeah.

[00:36:29] So what happens when a tragedy strikes a majority Christian area like, for example, Florida

[00:36:39] America currently, which is being pummeled by first Hurricane Helene and then Hurricane

[00:36:45] Milton.

[00:36:46] Right.

[00:36:46] Silence, right?

[00:36:48] No, not silence.

[00:36:50] Silence, right?

[00:36:51] Whereas they're not over there crying and saying, well, we must have had it coming.

[00:36:55] You know, we must have done something to piss God off.

[00:36:57] No, they're not talking about them at all.

[00:37:01] Yeah.

[00:37:01] Except to say, I am a victim of this hurricane, but you know what else I'm a victim of?

[00:37:07] They're diverting funds from FEMA to help us.

[00:37:11] Right.

[00:37:11] They hate us Christians so much.

[00:37:13] So you see how the shift in blame and moral superiority always places them in the right

[00:37:25] and Democrats, atheists, humanists, whoever does not fit their happy club in the negative.

[00:37:32] Sure.

[00:37:32] I mean, it's also part of the reason right now also is that I just want to point it out

[00:37:36] that we are less than a month, I think, away from the presidential election.

[00:37:42] Yeah.

[00:37:42] So, I mean, they're obviously going to focus heavily on that and make anything they can

[00:37:48] the Democrats fault.

[00:37:49] And, you know, honestly, this is not a great time for us to be having a national disaster.

[00:37:55] Right.

[00:37:56] With the national election coming up.

[00:37:58] But I'm not convinced that is just related to the election, though, because this has been

[00:38:05] building for quite some time.

[00:38:08] The you are bad.

[00:38:10] That's why you got punished.

[00:38:11] Oh, my God.

[00:38:12] You're so bad that now you're actively being mean to us victims.

[00:38:17] Right.

[00:38:17] Like the people that died in New Orleans or at the Pulse nightclub, they they were not victims.

[00:38:30] They were not like we don't feel sorry for them.

[00:38:33] You know what I mean?

[00:38:33] They were bad people who, according to evangelicals, they were bad people who got what they deserved.

[00:38:41] Sure.

[00:38:42] OK.

[00:38:42] The people that die in Florida of these hurricanes are not viewed as bad people who got what they deserved.

[00:38:50] Right.

[00:38:50] They just are people who are.

[00:38:54] Well, you were talking about a new phenomenon that I had not even heard of where people are now saying that we're controlling the weather.

[00:39:05] Yeah.

[00:39:05] Yeah.

[00:39:06] No.

[00:39:06] And I talked about that in the intro a little bit, but I literally heard that in passing in the world, not on social media twice in the last week.

[00:39:17] Where somebody came in where you work and just started talking about it off the street.

[00:39:21] Yeah.

[00:39:21] I'm like, how that that's just insane.

[00:39:24] It's common talk.

[00:39:24] It's insane.

[00:39:25] It's just it's in the zeitgeist now.

[00:39:27] Right.

[00:39:27] Right.

[00:39:28] It's just something that exists now.

[00:39:30] It's a truth to them.

[00:39:32] That just can't accept science is the answer.

[00:39:35] People can accept, you know, that it's never people want to complicate it.

[00:39:41] People want to have an answer as to why this happened.

[00:39:45] Right.

[00:39:46] There is no there is not an exact why.

[00:39:48] Well, I mean, you can't you can't satisfy a you can't attribute morality to a fucking hurricane.

[00:39:56] No, but you can instead of talking about the victims of the pulse nightclub shooting, instead of talking about the victims as bad people, you could talk about how the shooter was a fucking piece of shit for shooting.

[00:40:12] Well, yeah, but we don't talk about that.

[00:40:14] Right.

[00:40:15] They don't talk about it.

[00:40:16] They probably would praise him for, you know, taking care of business for them.

[00:40:20] I don't know.

[00:40:21] It seems like they might.

[00:40:22] I mean, if you hear him say anything about him at all, it seems like they might be happy about the guy.

[00:40:28] There are probably some people that teeter on that line.

[00:40:30] I don't think many people would say that that was a good thing.

[00:40:33] I don't know.

[00:40:34] They are.

[00:40:35] Once it happened, it's easier to attribute to something.

[00:40:38] You know, God punished these people.

[00:40:40] Right.

[00:40:40] Right.

[00:40:41] But we don't talk about the shooter and we don't talk about the individual people who died.

[00:40:47] We just talk about the group as a whole was bad and naughty.

[00:40:51] Because ultimately it comes down to, you know, groups or individuals bigotry and hate.

[00:40:57] Right.

[00:40:57] Right.

[00:40:57] These people have are hateful toward towards the LGBTQIA plus community.

[00:41:04] And it's just it comes out in moments like that because it's easy for they have a person.

[00:41:13] They have they have an entity that they can invoke that allows them to hate that group and justify what happened to them.

[00:41:20] They're no longer human.

[00:41:21] And they didn't do it.

[00:41:22] So obviously, you know, I didn't have anything to do with it.

[00:41:24] But obviously, God was angry at them.

[00:41:26] Right.

[00:41:27] It allows you to not hate, but hate.

[00:41:29] Right.

[00:41:29] And it's just it.

[00:41:30] And it justifies the hate that you have to them.

[00:41:33] Yeah.

[00:41:34] To them.

[00:41:34] Not to me.

[00:41:34] Oh, no.

[00:41:35] I still think it's very.

[00:41:37] It's gross.

[00:41:38] Yeah, it's gross.

[00:41:39] Not good.

[00:41:40] So there is this fascinating shift in rhetoric surrounding disaster and faith, though.

[00:41:46] Like it is a thing that is occurring.

[00:41:49] OK.

[00:41:50] And it seems that in the case of Hurricane Helene and Milton, some evangelicals are moving away from blaming victims and instead adopting a stance of righteous victimhood.

[00:42:00] This allows them to maintain a sense of moral superiority while deflecting criticism and demanding support.

[00:42:07] And that's what it's really about is the superiority that they feel as Christians.

[00:42:12] Yes.

[00:42:12] And let's just let's just be honest.

[00:42:13] White Christians.

[00:42:14] Yeah.

[00:42:15] Yeah, definitely.

[00:42:16] At all times.

[00:42:17] Generally speaking.

[00:42:18] They're always they're always superior in any way, whether they are on top or on the bottom.

[00:42:23] They are always the best, the best, the best.

[00:42:25] And even if they're not on top, they are the most afflicted and most shit on.

[00:42:29] Mm hmm.

[00:42:30] Like they are the most at something.

[00:42:31] Yeah.

[00:42:32] On any given day.

[00:42:32] Yeah, it's true.

[00:42:34] Yeah.

[00:42:34] Yeah.

[00:42:35] Here's a breakdown of this dynamic.

[00:42:37] OK.

[00:42:37] OK.

[00:42:38] There's the shifting of the blame.

[00:42:40] Instead of attributing the hurricanes to God's judgment on a sinful society, the focus shifts to the perceived failings of others to adequately assist the Christian victims.

[00:42:52] This could include the government aid organizations or even non-Christians in general.

[00:42:59] Yeah.

[00:43:00] Interesting.

[00:43:00] That's basically what's happening.

[00:43:01] Yeah.

[00:43:02] I mean, Democrats at this point to evangelical Christians is pretty much a catch all for anything shitty.

[00:43:10] Right.

[00:43:10] Yeah.

[00:43:11] Socialism, secular, you know, communism.

[00:43:15] Right.

[00:43:15] Anything that they deem as the antithesis of their beliefs is is basically what they view Democrats as like that.

[00:43:25] That is a legitimately a catch all for them.

[00:43:28] And I mean, I am guilty of that to a large degree to the opposite way.

[00:43:33] Right.

[00:43:33] But I pull you back from that.

[00:43:35] You do.

[00:43:36] That is it's not Republican is not a catch all for shitty people.

[00:43:40] Right.

[00:43:40] It's just not.

[00:43:41] No, I know.

[00:43:42] I know.

[00:43:43] And there are.

[00:43:45] We can we can speak in generalizations with regard to that because it is generally true that these things happen.

[00:43:52] But you cannot 100% say that that is the case.

[00:43:56] Right.

[00:43:56] That's why I was admitting that I am guilty of that.

[00:43:59] Sure.

[00:43:59] Like, I don't I don't want to be a hypocrite here.

[00:44:02] I do that.

[00:44:03] And it's not right when they do it.

[00:44:05] And it's not right when I do it.

[00:44:07] Right.

[00:44:07] So I am grateful that you pull me back from that.

[00:44:09] Yeah.

[00:44:09] And I think honestly, there's a lot more like because we aren't involved in being a Republican.

[00:44:15] Right.

[00:44:15] Mm hmm.

[00:44:16] There's probably, you know, a lot more nuance in that group than we actually understand ourselves.

[00:44:21] Sure.

[00:44:21] Right.

[00:44:21] And it's just a matter.

[00:44:23] And I'm not.

[00:44:23] I don't agree with Republicans.

[00:44:25] OK, I am not a Republican.

[00:44:27] I never will be a Republican.

[00:44:29] But much I know for a fact that Democrats are very diverse and very multifaceted and have very many.

[00:44:39] There's a lot of ideas under our umbrella.

[00:44:41] Right.

[00:44:41] Like that's that's that's the thing.

[00:44:43] Right.

[00:44:43] I think the Republicans are a little bit more narrow, but they also have different ideas.

[00:44:49] And that's why we've seen things like the the Lincoln group, the Lincoln project come out of.

[00:44:55] Yeah.

[00:44:56] You know, Trump has inspired people to leave the Republican Party as far as a voting bloc recently because they're not going to vote for his ass.

[00:45:04] Right.

[00:45:05] But they're still Republicans.

[00:45:07] Sure.

[00:45:07] Yeah.

[00:45:08] In name.

[00:45:08] Which is which is why I have such mixed feelings about Republicans who have rejected Trump vocally and have come over to, you know, the quote unquote dark side of Democrats.

[00:45:19] Democrats, you know.

[00:45:21] Right.

[00:45:22] Right.

[00:45:22] Because I still believe that they help pave the way for what's happening now, even if they're breaking away here at the last minute trying to help Kamala.

[00:45:29] But they would say the same thing if we put some sort of a horrible person in office on the Democrat side.

[00:45:36] Right.

[00:45:36] They would say that you you guys paved the way for this to happen.

[00:45:39] Right.

[00:45:39] OK, but here's the thing.

[00:45:40] The difference is that we criticized vocally our leader.

[00:45:45] They would never do that except for the few who say that.

[00:45:50] But the Lincoln project is very vocal and very.

[00:45:52] You're right.

[00:45:53] OK, you're right.

[00:45:54] You're right.

[00:45:54] Of Trump.

[00:45:55] I'm not trying to.

[00:45:57] You know, I I tend to mostly agree with what you're saying ish, but I want to be careful of saying that it's a hundred.

[00:46:05] You know, that's just not.

[00:46:06] No, you're right.

[00:46:07] You're right.

[00:46:08] Not the way it exactly is.

[00:46:10] You're right.

[00:46:10] And I I get heated and start talking shit.

[00:46:15] I know.

[00:46:16] Yeah.

[00:46:17] Yeah.

[00:46:17] OK, so besides the shifting of blame, we also get the claiming moral high ground, which we've discussed.

[00:46:24] Yeah.

[00:46:25] By presenting themselves as victims of both the natural disaster and the supposed apathy of others, they reinforce their own sense of righteousness and portray non-Christians as lacking in compassion and morality, which just cracks me the fuck up because we are empathetic.

[00:46:44] A lot of us, you know, like we do want to help people.

[00:46:49] That's kind of why they don't like us, because the people that we want to help are the oppressed because we're a diverse group.

[00:46:57] Right.

[00:46:58] You know, and they're like, you have no sympathy and empathy and compassion for us.

[00:47:03] And it's like, no, we we have compassion and empathy and sympathy for people.

[00:47:07] It's just that you don't fucking need it.

[00:47:09] You're white and you have a church group and you're on top of the fucking world, generally speaking.

[00:47:15] Right.

[00:47:15] I've seen multiple studies that show.

[00:47:17] So there's two sides to this.

[00:47:19] I've seen ones that say that atheists and secular are more giving than Christians.

[00:47:27] OK.

[00:47:28] So when we when we look at it, it's a matter of like the studies I've seen where atheists, secular are more giving than Christians.

[00:47:40] It's been more of a psychological evaluation type thing as far as their mentality, their mindset, how they like if they're given a scenario to donate to somebody that's in need.

[00:47:49] The atheist secular are more likely to do it.

[00:47:52] OK.

[00:47:53] But generally speaking, monetarily, Christians give more money towards causes than atheists secular do.

[00:48:01] So but they also have more direct ways to do that because their churches often like the way they can.

[00:48:08] They're instructed to, though, they're instructed to and their churches take up, you know, donation plates for these things.

[00:48:13] Right.

[00:48:14] So it's it's easier built.

[00:48:16] It's ingrained into that society.

[00:48:18] Yeah.

[00:48:19] But they use those charts to show Christians are much more giving than than atheists and secular.

[00:48:24] And it's like, well, yeah, we don't have a structure.

[00:48:27] We don't go to the atheist church on Sunday.

[00:48:30] We don't have a place to get together.

[00:48:33] And other than our discord.

[00:48:35] So you should come join us on discord.

[00:48:36] Right.

[00:48:36] It's fun.

[00:48:37] And you'll love it.

[00:48:39] But, you know, I can't pass a plate through the Internet.

[00:48:43] So no.

[00:48:43] Well, another thing is that the whole point of this giving is supposed to be that it means something personal to you as you do it.

[00:48:54] And you recognize that it's helping somebody when you're putting money into a fucking plate that gets passed down the aisle.

[00:49:00] Personal is that?

[00:49:01] Was that was that really a giving to something?

[00:49:04] No, it was obligatory because you're you're feeling pressure from your peers to do something.

[00:49:09] Right.

[00:49:09] Yeah.

[00:49:10] One of my favorite memes I've seen, like, is that it's Cheech Marin or I don't remember what I think is Cheech.

[00:49:17] It's a picture of him reaching into a collection plate and taking money out and like, oh, I prayed to God for money and it just showed up right in front of me.

[00:49:27] Something along those lines.

[00:49:28] I'm not doing it exact justice, but it's hilarious.

[00:49:31] It was for the needy.

[00:49:32] Right.

[00:49:32] OK, so the next thing is justifying demands for support.

[00:49:40] This victimhood narrative can be used to justify demands for preferential treatment and resources, arguing that Christians are deserving of special consideration due to their faith and the perceived injustices that they faced.

[00:49:54] Right.

[00:49:54] Like, it's so convenient to be a white Christian nationalist.

[00:50:00] No, that's exactly what privilege is.

[00:50:02] Yeah.

[00:50:03] Is white Christian nationalism.

[00:50:05] Yeah.

[00:50:05] You know, because that those people have some of the most privileged access to non judgment from, you know, bosses from the government, from like they get everything but claim their their shit on for everything, too.

[00:50:22] Yeah.

[00:50:22] Yeah.

[00:50:23] They get the best of both worlds.

[00:50:24] And again, I'm generalizing here.

[00:50:26] I'm being a little, you know, hyperbolic here.

[00:50:28] But I mean, it there are definitely people that are more, you know, shit on than than white evangelical Christians.

[00:50:37] But they act sometimes like they're the most shit on.

[00:50:40] Yeah.

[00:50:40] So that's just it bothers me.

[00:50:42] No, me, too.

[00:50:42] Me, too.

[00:50:43] Right.

[00:50:44] And the last one is maintaining a sense of us versus them.

[00:50:47] This rhetoric reinforces the division between Christians and non Christians, fostering a sense of persecution and fueling resentment towards those outside the faith.

[00:50:58] Yeah.

[00:50:58] So.

[00:50:59] And I'm about sick of the persecuted Christian.

[00:51:01] Oh, me, too.

[00:51:01] I really am.

[00:51:02] Me, too.

[00:51:03] Because I they these persecuted, quote unquote, persecuted Christians tell me all about how persecuted they are every fucking day.

[00:51:11] And you know what?

[00:51:12] I never talk about in public.

[00:51:15] The fact that I'm a fucking atheist with a podcast.

[00:51:17] Right.

[00:51:18] Ever.

[00:51:18] Right.

[00:51:19] Like unless I have judged that I'm not going to get shot that day by that person.

[00:51:22] Right.

[00:51:23] You know what I mean?

[00:51:23] Like I do talk about it, but I have to pick my you have to be selective.

[00:51:28] You don't just walk into a store and start spouting off at the mouth your beliefs.

[00:51:33] Right.

[00:51:33] Right.

[00:51:33] But it doesn't seem to even occur to them that maybe they shouldn't do that.

[00:51:38] Maybe maybe watch your fucking mouth.

[00:51:41] Maybe.

[00:51:41] I don't know.

[00:51:42] Maybe other people don't think like you.

[00:51:45] Yeah.

[00:51:45] Hush.

[00:51:46] You know, but they just walk around the world assuming what everybody thinks like me.

[00:51:50] My neighbors do.

[00:51:51] So why don't you?

[00:51:52] Of course you do.

[00:51:53] They're white.

[00:51:54] Right.

[00:51:55] Well, and just generally speaking, even if someone doesn't believe in God, I've discovered

[00:52:01] many people in positions of power will speak by saying things like, well, I'm praying for

[00:52:08] you.

[00:52:08] I'm, you know, I, you know, there's these these platitudes, these Christian platitudes

[00:52:13] that get tossed around like, you know, whatever candy, you know, I was looking for something

[00:52:19] better than a candy reference.

[00:52:20] But anyway, they get tossed around like nothing.

[00:52:23] Right.

[00:52:24] And and they aren't necessarily because the person is Christian.

[00:52:28] They aren't necessarily because.

[00:52:29] But it's just a fitting in.

[00:52:31] Right.

[00:52:32] These these words, these motions, these these actions happen.

[00:52:36] And even sometimes prayer.

[00:52:38] Yeah.

[00:52:38] Right.

[00:52:38] It might happen publicly and in jobs and in different places because there is such a fear

[00:52:46] of going against it.

[00:52:47] And and more than that, even if you don't necessarily believe in God, if you are the one that wants

[00:52:53] to get ahead, if you show that you're a Christian, oftentimes that wins you points.

[00:52:58] Well, I was going to say, I mean, you would not speak up where you work and be like, hey, anybody

[00:53:04] want to come over and, you know, we're doing an atheist gathering.

[00:53:08] That's not necessarily true.

[00:53:10] I haven't thus far, but I I don't necessarily I might say something eventually.

[00:53:17] Huh.

[00:53:18] But it's that's interesting to me.

[00:53:20] The way I it's much like how I we've talked about how I deal with getting my ideas into

[00:53:27] the the the discussions.

[00:53:30] Right.

[00:53:30] Like I I try to learn what I can from the people that I'm going to be talking to.

[00:53:35] And then I interject where I can and I slowly work my way into the conversation to get these

[00:53:41] might get my ideas and my views across more effectively and from someone that they they feel

[00:53:47] like they trust and know because I listened.

[00:53:50] I listened to them.

[00:53:50] I let them have the right to speak.

[00:53:53] Right.

[00:53:53] Yeah.

[00:53:53] So it takes me a little longer with the atheist stuff, but I've already come out as a as a

[00:53:58] liberal to most of the people that I work with.

[00:54:01] That is so interesting to me.

[00:54:03] And I've actually had conversations about our kid being trans.

[00:54:06] And so like these are conversations that I am currently having.

[00:54:09] I did not have only been there three months.

[00:54:11] OK.

[00:54:11] And when you first started, you were like, well, yeah, I mean, we talked about it in our discord

[00:54:16] that there is people that are dressed up in, you know, full camo, you know, whatever year

[00:54:22] with their AK 47 arsenal behind them and whatever.

[00:54:26] Yeah.

[00:54:26] But I have worked myself into it.

[00:54:29] Like I, I make sure I'm one of the best at what I do.

[00:54:32] And then I also make sure that I earned the respect of people enough to where I can start

[00:54:37] being who I am.

[00:54:39] Mm hmm.

[00:54:40] And at that they will listen and respect my opinion on those matters because I've already entered.

[00:54:47] I've already presented myself as someone who is able to hold a conversation and able to hold my own.

[00:54:53] Mm hmm.

[00:54:54] And is friendly and helpful and reliable.

[00:54:56] Yeah.

[00:54:57] So I work my way into these conversations and I will probably eventually have the discussion about what I do on the side.

[00:55:04] That's so interesting to me.

[00:55:05] It just takes some time to get there.

[00:55:06] It's not something like being a Christian.

[00:55:08] You can come out on day one and be like, I pray to God every day and I love God.

[00:55:13] God's so awesome.

[00:55:14] Mm hmm.

[00:55:15] You can't do that with atheism.

[00:55:17] Right.

[00:55:17] I mean, you can, but it wouldn't have won me any points.

[00:55:21] It wouldn't have gotten me anywhere.

[00:55:22] In fact, it probably would have hurt me.

[00:55:25] And you have to figure out how to navigate that.

[00:55:29] Yeah.

[00:55:29] When Christians are like we're persecuted for being Christian and we get fired.

[00:55:32] Like, no, you probably got fired because you're an asshole.

[00:55:35] Yeah.

[00:55:36] Like, you're not the only one that gets judged, motherfucker.

[00:55:41] I don't know.

[00:55:42] I don't know what I'm trying to say, but I'm just going to finish this off.

[00:55:44] My last thing I'm going to say is the emergence of this blame shifting victimhood narrative is a concerning trend.

[00:55:53] It highlights the ongoing challenges in navigating the intersection of faith, disaster and social responsibility.

[00:56:02] Yeah.

[00:56:02] It also underscores the need for critical reflection on religious rhetoric and its potential impact on attitudes towards suffering and those in need.

[00:56:11] I completely agree.

[00:56:13] Yeah.

[00:56:14] Yeah.

[00:56:14] I mean, that's part of why we do this whole thing.

[00:56:19] Yes.

[00:56:20] Because there is a need to examine how we relate to Christianity, religion in general in our society and how that affects people who are not in privilege.

[00:56:34] Right.

[00:56:36] That's where or don't hold the same views.

[00:56:39] You know, like it's one thing to say that you are doing these things because of your God.

[00:56:44] But there are other people that have other gods in our country.

[00:56:48] Yeah.

[00:56:48] And you're not doing it by their God.

[00:56:51] Yeah.

[00:56:51] You know, you're acting on the whim of your, you're acting with your views in mind only.

[00:57:01] And you're using God as a reason to have those views.

[00:57:05] Right.

[00:57:05] It doesn't matter who you are.

[00:57:08] To be fair, you know, I am using my political views as a reason to have my views.

[00:57:13] Right.

[00:57:13] I have views, but I feel like I've come at them.

[00:57:16] I've, I've come to those views from a point of learning as opposed to a point of indoctrination.

[00:57:24] Yeah.

[00:57:24] And that to me is what I strive to do is, and I'm willing to listen.

[00:57:30] I'm willing to adapt.

[00:57:31] I'm willing to update my knowledge.

[00:57:34] Right.

[00:57:35] I don't feel like Christian ideology allows as much of that.

[00:57:40] No, I don't either.

[00:57:41] And I've seen it stunt intellectual growth.

[00:57:46] Right.

[00:57:46] And moreover, I feel like it kind of inspires hate in the world and inspires negative thoughts

[00:57:53] about other people and other, you know, cultures.

[00:57:56] It others them.

[00:57:57] Yeah.

[00:57:57] It definitely does.

[00:57:58] It makes them subhuman.

[00:58:00] And that allows you to treat them however you want, because once you've decided that

[00:58:05] they are not humans equal to you, you know, it not only allows you to treat them however

[00:58:10] you want, but it allows you to view the treatment of them however you want, which is more important

[00:58:15] because you're not usually the one that's going to be doing the treating.

[00:58:18] Yeah.

[00:58:18] But you are the one that's allowing that treatment to happen.

[00:58:22] Yeah.

[00:58:23] And that's the problem.

[00:58:24] Yeah.

[00:58:24] We can't keep letting these shitty treatments happen to people who happen to not be white

[00:58:31] evangelical Christians.

[00:58:32] Right.

[00:58:32] That's the problem.

[00:58:34] Yeah.

[00:58:35] All right.

[00:58:36] I think that all we got for today.

[00:58:37] That's all we got for today.

[00:58:39] Okay.

[00:58:39] Well, I really do.

[00:58:40] I want to reiterate.

[00:58:41] I hope everyone in Florida is safe right now.

[00:58:44] I hope all those of you who are recovering from the last hurricane, specifically places

[00:58:49] like Asheville in North Carolina, I hope you guys are safe and well and recovering.

[00:58:56] So it's, I know it's been a rough time for a lot of people in this country.

[00:59:00] And we felt like this was a topic that needed to be discussed because disasters keep happening

[00:59:08] and they're going to be happening in greater and greater number with climate change being

[00:59:12] a real thing.

[00:59:13] Yeah.

[00:59:14] With, you know, the rise of terrorist activity from homegrown terrorists being a real thing.

[00:59:21] Yeah.

[00:59:21] Disasters are going to continue to increase and rise.

[00:59:24] School shootings.

[00:59:25] And the response from the Republican right is going to matter because it's going to be part

[00:59:30] of the discussion, but we need to be prepared for that discussion and we need to fight back

[00:59:34] about how those viewpoints are presented to the world.

[00:59:37] Yeah.

[00:59:37] Agreed.

[00:59:38] Agreed.

[00:59:39] That's, that's pretty much it.

[00:59:41] Yep.

[00:59:41] Thank you guys.

[00:59:42] I appreciate everybody coming out today and listening to our episode.

[00:59:46] Make sure next week it because it's going to be a Patreon only or a discord only.

[00:59:52] Right.

[00:59:52] Which means that you can catch it for free on Wednesday at 10 p.m.

[00:59:57] Eastern on discord on discord.

[00:59:59] Yeah.

[00:59:59] So make sure you sign up.

[01:00:00] There's always a link in the show notes.

[01:00:02] And that being said, we didn't get out the wrap up stuff for Hosea earlier this week because

[01:00:08] we suck, but it will be out the rest of where we're going to from here forward.

[01:00:12] We're going to get out the rest of this week and we'll wrap up Hosea here after this special.

[01:00:16] And then we'll start next week with the new book of the Bible, which is a Joel.

[01:00:21] Jeff?

[01:00:22] Oh yeah Jeff.

[01:00:23] Yeah.

[01:00:24] It's Joel.

[01:00:24] It's Joel.

[01:00:25] But bye.

[01:00:29] Bye!

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