Isaiah Chapter 15:
Ever wondered how ancient prophecies still ripple through our modern world? Welcome to an episode where we unpack the devastating prophecy against Moab, as depicted in Isaiah, Chapter 15, and its unsettling relevance today. We journey back to a night of horror, where Moab's two cities were reduced to rubble, and countless lives were extinguished. We feel the anguish of desolate people, their tears, their cries to gods who seemed silent. The agonizing parallels between this ancient catastrophe and current Israeli-Palestinian conflicts are impossible to ignore, underscoring the cyclical nature of human suffering and conflict.
Brace yourself as we steer the conversation towards the disturbing aftermath of Moab's doom. The aftermath paints a chilling picture of religious intolerance - one that many would argue, resonates uncomfortably within our contemporary socio-political landscape. We critically probe the practice of using this prophecy as a disturbing justification for territorial claims, particularly those related to the state of Israel. The grim reality of celebrating carnage in the name of religion is unequivocally challenged. As we close, we look forward to answering your queries on our upcoming Q&A Saturday, the exclusive content for our Patrons this Sunday, and to our next deep dive into Isaiah Chapter 16. Join us for this thought-provoking discourse, as we weave narratives from the past into the present-day context.
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00:00 - Wife (Host)
Wife. Do you remember what happened and where we are?
00:04 - Husband (Host)
Yeah, I believe in the last chapter we had Some that well, the foreigners they joined, they joined the Israelites. I think joined is doing some heavy lifting, it was doing some heavy lifting there, because it meant slavery it did yeah, I don't know how they got from joined Slavery, but that's what they meant by it was slavery.
00:24 - Wife (Host)
They didn't just be like hey, can I come be your slave? How would would you guys mind if I slave for you? That was just not generally how that goes, that would be joining and that did not happen.
00:34 - Husband (Host)
No, that did not. That did not happen. They did not join, they, they they were enslaved. They were enslaved. Yes, and so that was Isaiah, chapter 14 sure buck was and so today's Friday, and we are reading Isaiah. I'm sorry, what are we reading today? I thought that I was jumping the gun here.
00:53 - Wife (Host)
You are. You are today. We are reading Isaiah, chapter 15.
00:57 - Husband (Host)
All right, you ready to do this?
00:58 - Wife (Host)
I sure am let's do it. All right.
01:11 - Husband (Host)
Isaiah, chapter 15, okay we're doing more prophecies more probably that is Isaiah, and Isaiah is a prophet, so it kind of makes sense.
01:20 - Wife (Host)
That is what he says, but this one is about Moab. Okay the first verse goes a prophecy against Moab against a prophecy against Moab.
01:30 - Husband (Host)
Mm-hmm, this can't be good for Moab, it's not gonna be good or the Moabites are in.
01:35 - Wife (Host)
Moab is ruined.
01:38 - Husband (Host)
Okay, I got it, yeah, yeah there's a place called are.
01:41 - Wife (Host)
It's in Moab and it's ruined, destroyed in a night.
01:45 - Husband (Host)
And then okay, here.
01:47 - Wife (Host)
KIR. Yeah in Moab is ruined. Oh shit destroyed in a night.
01:52 - Husband (Host)
Is this Israel Warring against them? Or is God just like smashing them with Magma flames or something?
01:59 - Wife (Host)
like boom goes the time.
02:01 - Husband (Host)
Yeah, I mean, I have no idea what's going on here.
02:02 - Wife (Host)
I don't know, but they got destroyed in a night. I don't know I don't even know if it was the same night. Okay, all right, yeah, but two places are done each in a night might have been the same night, some cities of some indeterminate size.
02:13 - Husband (Host)
Yeah are gone. Yeah, okay.
02:15 - Wife (Host)
Debonne di B oh and it's Dagon.
02:28 - Husband (Host)
That one right no, it wasn't right. I'm sorry.
02:30 - Wife (Host)
Sorry, I feel bad for those people thousands of Okay, it goes up to its temple, to its high places to weep.
02:40 - Husband (Host)
Okay, weeping, okay yeah.
02:42 - Wife (Host)
Moab whales over Nibo and Mediba.
02:46 - Husband (Host)
Okay every head is shaved and every beard cut off because they're they're wailing and they're sad Because all these cities are gone overnight and they went to their high places because they worshiped their high places on top of mountains, yes, where they built their altars because they were not Godly or something, and that's not even though, godly, people sometimes build altars on top of mountains, right? So I don't, okay. I'm just trying to figure this all out in my head.
03:12 - Wife (Host)
Maybe it was the wrong God it was probably the. It was the wrong God, I'm sure yeah, in the streets they wear sackcloth, on the roofs and in the public squares they all wail.
03:22 - Husband (Host)
See, they are similar to the Israelites. They wore sackcloth when they when they want to Cry and cross straight with weeping. Yeah.
03:29 - Wife (Host)
Yeah, yeah, they're very sad.
03:31 - Husband (Host)
Okay.
03:32 - Wife (Host)
They are much like the other people in that when God smites their people, mm-hmm, they are sad about it.
03:39 - Husband (Host)
I mean, I think smiting always people in general react very similarly to Shitty things happening to them. Yeah, it's sad.
03:47 - Wife (Host)
Yeah, yeah, people get sad over sad things and when we cause sad things, we, in fact, are the bad guy.
03:55 - Husband (Host)
Right, yes, yes.
03:57 - Wife (Host)
Hesbon and Alila Eliola Cry out.
04:04 - Husband (Host)
Okay.
04:05 - Wife (Host)
Their voices are heard all the way to J has all that way. That's a far way.
04:11 - Husband (Host)
Apparently a far way from what I understand.
04:13 - Wife (Host)
Yes, Therefore, the armed men of Moab cry out and their hearts are faint. My heart cries out over Moab and I must be Isaiah.
04:26 - Husband (Host)
I'm assuming Isaiah is the one prophesying this.
04:29 - Wife (Host)
Yeah even my heart. Isaiah cries over Moab.
04:32 - Husband (Host)
Well, yeah, it's never. I Can't imagine not being sad if somebody was dying, if you were dying yeah, that is sad.
04:39 - Wife (Host)
Her fugitives flee as far as Zoar, as far as Eagle. If Sheila Shia, they go up the hill to Lou Hith, weeping as they go okay on the road to Horan Neum. They lament their destruction. I see the waters of Nimrim are dried up and the grass is withered.
05:03 - Husband (Host)
That's no good.
05:04 - Wife (Host)
The vegetation is gone and nothing green is left. Okay maybe they should go cry over there. And here's Kim water, the field.
05:11 - Husband (Host)
Yeah, that was, that would not, that would now. Yeah, that was mean.
05:15 - Wife (Host)
Sorry, sorry, moab. So the wealth they have acquired and stored up, they carry away over the ravine of the poplars. Their outcry echoes along the border of Moab. They're wailing reaches as far as e-glam, their lamentation as far as beer a lamb. The waters of Demond are full of blood, but I will bring still more upon Demond a Lion, upon the fugitives of Moab and upon those who remain in the land. The end so I.
05:51 - Husband (Host)
They didn't specifically state this, but I don't. God's never really fought on his own right. Right, like he always brings people in to do the fighting form. So it sounds to me like the Israelites are Literally warring against the Moabites. That's what it sounds like and killing a lot of them and driving them out of their homes, which sounds pretty shitty to me.
06:12 - Wife (Host)
Yeah, actually kind of sounds like what's happening right now between the Israelites and the Palestinians. Right right in a way.
06:20 - Husband (Host)
Yeah, I just it's a whatever there, whatever happened here. It's a really Poetic way of saying they got shit on by somebody. Mm-hmm and they're gonna say that God was doing it, because they're not godly. I guess that's the.
06:34 - Wife (Host)
That's the whole Thing here, I guess and that's why their waters are full of blood and they're gonna get a lion Put upon them right, right.
06:45 - Husband (Host)
So so I had Moabites got it bad in this chapter, I guess again, again, even though they say it's more nuanced than this.
06:54 - Wife (Host)
Worship me or I will kill you.
06:57 - Husband (Host)
Right, that's essentially what it always boils down to, right. Give me what I want, at the very least at the very least he's gonna abandon you, mm-hmm, at the very very least. You better hope, I abandon you right and not and not kill you. I will kill you or enslave you, because you know that that's a thing.
07:13 - Wife (Host)
Mm-hmm so.
07:15 - Husband (Host)
I don't have anything else to add. This was a very short chapter very short. A lot of those lately very sad very sad, mm-hmm. Yeah, it's, I mean it's sad and so far as people died, but they also died so many years ago that it's hard to it's hard to quantify what actually happened here. And yeah, it's, I don't know. I'm not saying that it's not sad, it is sad. I mean, human tragedy is sad, but they are long gone.
07:41 - Wife (Host)
Right, it's just that we're supposed to be like, well, that's what they get for not Worshipping God. Right, and I being is realized right.
07:49 - Husband (Host)
I think I think that's the more important statement here is that, in the context of the Bible, if you see this as a good thing, that's, that's kind of a tear you're terrible. Yeah, you're a terrible person. Yeah like you, should never celebrate other people killing other people or God killing other people that's horrible right and I don't understand why people think that it is right or correct Like I don't particularly care about the Moabites. I'm not like I don't know what they are really right.
08:17 - Wife (Host)
I'm not particularly sad that that they died. I'm just sad that Anybody was killed in the name of you didn't worship my God, so right and also I want your land real bad.
08:29 - Husband (Host)
It's the general idea of how they treat people and gent like in these situations that are not part of their religion, and and how they.
08:38 - Wife (Host)
They murder them without question and they don't really feel Unjustified in doing so right and then people today point to it and say that's right and good and just right, it's part of the justification for Israel's current state of things.
08:53 - Husband (Host)
Yeah, they justify Israel, because what Israel's supposed to be there, that's their land.
08:57 - Wife (Host)
Yeah, so so in the Bible says so in the Bible.
09:01 - Husband (Host)
All right, anyway, enough rambling about that. That was a really short chapter. That was Isaiah, chapter 15. Sure as fuck was, and today is Friday, so we will be back tomorrow with Q&A Saturday and then on Sunday, I believe we are doing. Patreon and then I will get a weekly wrap-up done and we will be back on Monday with Isaiah, chapter 16. All right, we'll see you guys then.
09:31 - Wife (Host)
Bye.
